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Tough courses. Played Saguaro and Tortolita. Beautiful courses, but not for most amateur golfers. No ball washers or club wash on carts, so they give you a towel and say wet it in the ice chest where they have bottled water. Very tough undulating greens which are hard to read and firm for approach shots. Great for a one time play to experience a very tough course. Unless you are a good player, recommend playing at least one tee forward of your normal game or you will be more frustrated. I can understand why the pros didn’t have good comments when they played here. Scoring a 38 on Tortolita from the copper tees was my enjoyment for the day.